Exorcism Number Thirteen: Chris Pierce

Hey you guys... I'm back. I have some really amazing interviews around the corner, but I am especially excited to share this one with you. It's with Chris Pierce from, well, 8 million bands including Doc Hopper, Groucho Marxists, and For Science. If you play music in the area, he has probably recorded your band either at Technical Ecstasy or more recently at Vol IV. He is a multi-talented dude and a really awesome dad. I was honored with how much he opened up and spoke about in this interview...or that he even wanted to be interviewed at all. I look up to the guy and I bet you do too. You will after reading this. Check it out.

this is Pierce with his adorable kid, Gibson!

What instruments do you play and which is your favorite? Which do you feel most proficient at?  Which do you feel most comfortable playing?

Ok, starting off,  I've been playing drums now for longer than I can remember, and guitar since I was ten or so. I love playing drums, and I see the world through a drummer's eye, but it's easier to lead a band as the guitarist. It's hard to say which I'm more proficient at, it depends on the band. I'm all about THE SONG....it's all fun, I love playing music and can do any role needed.
 
What was the first band you were in and what did you play?

The first band I was in was called DISTORTION... I played guitar and then became the default singer. We did metal covers, we were all in 6th and 7th grades so our musical vocabulary had yet to develop. Every band I was in early on did Judas Priest's "you've got another thing coming" and a slew of Twisted Sister and AC/DC songs. Until we discovered Metallica and thrash in general.

Playing shows at that point were fantasies. Until DIY and punk entered my life, I was an isolated metal kid growing up in rural Maine in the 80's. Not a lot of fun. There were no clubs or venues around us.

Do you have a favorite tour that you went on?

Hard to pin down. I skipped my high school graduation to do a 11 week tour with a band called The AGs and that was such a crazy learning experience. I really love touring and all it entails so there are awesome moments and there are shitty moments on every tour.

Which musicians/bands made you want to start a band?

I was a KISS kid from age 4 or so, and the Monkees tv show was what I thought every band lived like for most of my life. Plus my mom was a hippie and I had every Beatles record growing up. Those 3 bands, then throw in AC/DC and you have how I learned my instruments and how I learned about song structure. Metallica was big for me too. I remember the day we found out about Cliff Burton the way some people remembered learning about JFK. 

Do you remember a moment where you realized you wanted to play music and not just watch/listen?

 I think it was my 8th grade talent show. We were the only band and we opened the whole show with Twisted Sister's "the kids are back," and closed the show with "you shook me all night long." Girls who would never talk to me in person were dancing and jumping around while we were playing. I knew playing music was what I was born to do.

I feel like I always gravitate toward asking drum questions, BUT who are your favorite drummers? What makes them better in your mind than others? Do you have any drumming pet peeves? Like weird set-up or whatever?

As for favorite drummers, Bill Stevenson is huge for me, as is Bill Ward, Phil Rudd, Dale Crover, and John Bonham. It's all about playing just enough and not too much. On the other side, Clive Burr (original Iron Maiden drummer) was very musical and added a ton to their sound. There was a time I would have said Lars Ulrich, but now I know he plays drums like a stutterer speaks. If there weren't multi-track recording, Ulrich would not be able to play some of those songs. 

Drummer pet peeves: tappers, over emotive guys, lefties are visually offensive, and drummers with great kits that they don't know how to tune.

What are some general things about bands that make them stand out to you? As in... besides, like, being good musicians and playing together are there other less tangible things that make you want to watch a band?

It's all about songs for me. There needs to be a hook in it somewhere, either vocally or somewhere else. Some crazy grind bands have awesome riffs, or just a great THING in a song and that's all I need. Delivery is important. Obviously I like the aggression in hardcore and punk, and some attitude and personality can make or break a band.

What made you want to record music and become an engineer? What was the process of learning how to create records like?

I had a cassette 4track when I was 15 or so, and that led me into recording my band and doing demos of myself. I took a college recording course when I was still in HS and I was totally hooked. I always knew that being a rock star was a big gamble, but being a recording engineer might actually be a good gig. I went to a recording school in 1991 after high school, and I was one of the last classes to work on analog multi-track machines. They talked about how there is technology coming out soon (ADATs came out that year) that would make digital recording accessible to the masses and that we might not "need" these big dinosaur machines anymore. I fell in love with big consoles and tape and have never stopped. I bugged all of my friends in bands to let me come to their sessions, and eventually bands asked me to record them without the house engineer. Crazy as it sounds, there was a time that if a band walked into a studio, they guy behind the console would have no clue as to what the band wanted. Before Nirvana, before Green Day, you either had goofy metal guys or the other extreme of jazzy types.I tried to use Husker Du as a reference when we made the first Doc Hopper single in 1991 and they had no idea who I was talking about. That made me want to help my friends bands make records that sounded better than the records we all listened to. 

What are some records that stand out as being perfectly put together sound-wise? What are examples of  favorite guitar/bass/drum/vocal sounds?

"Appetite for Destruction" is perfect example of a perfect sounding record. The planets were in alignment that those morons could make such an excellent album. AC/DC always had great sounding records with not a lot of weird stuff going on. I love the drums on "slip it in." "Dookie" sounds almost perfect too. I like very presence-y vocals and loud guitars in general. Records I thought were great back when I was younger don't always hold up. The 80's and its technology fucked up a lot of great records and bands for years to come.

This feels like a dumb question but here goes: Besides that it is a less controlled environment, how does mixing a band live differ from recording sounds?

Live vs studio... Live you can't tailor the sounds to fit together the same way you do for recording in the studio. It's about damage and volume control. Sometimes when I'm mixing live, I'll try to tell the drummer if his gear is really out of whack and let him tune stuff up, but if its too many bands with too little time, all I can do is tune out the horrible frequencies of that shitty snare and go with it. Make it sound bearable for the 30 minute set. You only get one quick chance to make things sound good. It keeps me on my toes, plus I love watching bands so if I can't make records all the time, I enjoy mixing live. 

 What was your favorite recording experience with one of your bands? What was your favorite recording experience with another band?

It was great making the third Sinkhole record up in Maine at a big place called Big Sound. My younger brother helped me with my drum stuff and we literally slept in the live room around the drum kit. We did that a few days in a row, then it was done. I like records like that, encapsulating a time and place for a band. I don't enjoy a dragged out over thought kind of thing. Rock and roll isn't about that. 

I loved making all the Ergs records, especially "dork rock."  It felt magical when we were doing it, and obviously we all could relate on musical terms. The Measure's "songs about people..." was great too, but honestly I love Fid and we always have fun making music together no matter what the situation is. 

PERSONAL.

Where'd you grow up and what are/were you parents like? Do you have siblings?

I grew up in Gardiner Maine, about an hour north of Portland. It was hard to get music up there, and there was never any live music around. My mom was really into music and she is where I got all of my musical interest from. My parents were divorced when I was 2 or so and I never really saw them together. My father is great and I had both of them in my life for most of my childhood. We lived in a small town, so there wasn't much distance between the two households. 

When I was in 2nd grade my Mom moved to Massachusets to work for the newly formed Digital Corp which eventually became Hewlett Packard. There wasn't much going on in Maine so she felt that was the best way to provide a future for her and I. I stayed with my dad and my grandparents through most of that.

When I was 10, my mother was raped and murdered by someone in her apartment building in Lawrence Mass. I don't remember much else about that year, and it took a long time to process most of the info that filtered down to me from my grandparents. I do remember someone at my school saying something about my mother living with God and the angels in heaven and my response being something to the effect of  "if there is a God why would he do this to me?" and having a severe dislike for the church and anyone using that as an explanation for what happened.

 I have a step brother and step sister, as well as a half brother (all younger than me.) But we all love each other as blood and they are all amazing people. I made my brother move to NJ when he got out of high school and seemed to be doing nothing because I wanted him to see the world outside of Maine. Only the youngest still lives in Maine. Not many people escape living up there. It's that kind of place. 

How has becoming a parent changed your outlook on stuff?

Being a parent has definitely changed my outlook. It's given me a purpose. I do everything I do so I can make his life better, even through a divorce and all the other crap this world throws at you. He keeps me grounded, and inspires me every time I think of him. 

I learned too early that the world is a cruel and unjust place, but I try to do all I can to not instill that in my son. I try to have faith in humanity for him, and occasionally humanity surprises me.

What was school like for you?

School sucked for me. I was usually bored, got bullied and terrorized by hicks all the time. Getting yelled at from a car was a common occurrence. "Fag" was a nickname. Music and skateboarding were my escapes. Luckily I powered through without too many issues. And the same people still work at 7-11 up there. Living well is the best revenge.

What is your favorite place that you have lived?

I love New Brunswick. I lived in Boston from 91-96, and it was fun. I miss it sometimes, but Hub City is the best hands down. The people, the scene, being close to NYC... it's the best ever. I almost moved to Minneapolis once, but it's wicked cold there. I don't like cold.

Have you ever had any weird or paranormal experiences?

I want to believe in ghosts and that stuff, but I'm too much of a doubter. I need to see it to believe it. 

The only thing I believe in that can't be seen is the power of music and community. I've experienced both of those and I know they exist. 

To quote Stiff Little Fingers, "I believe in the power of guitar and drums." For reals yo.

 Real quick...

First off ...thanks so much Chris. This definitely made me tear up a little bit and I know I never say much at the end of the interview. But I just wanna point out that the whole reason why I  started doing this is to see the motivations behind what some of my favorite people's musical interests are. And to like, LEARN about them without it being too uncomfortable and scary. This interview definitely made me understand a dude I have known for YEARS a whole lot better. Because I really had almost no knowledge of this guy's history before, and now I will never think of him as the same Chris Pierce I knew before. You know what I mean? I hope you enjoyed reading because I sure did.

<3 Randa

Exorcism Number Twelve: Brian "Buckets" Buccellato

Hey! I'm back to being nosy. Thank god. This is an interview with Mr. Brian Buckets. I feel like I asked him some pretty straight-forward, perfunctory questions and got unusual and interesting answers. Which is, of course, really neat. He and Chris Pierce (whose interview is forthcoming BTW) have a recording studio together called Volume IV. (Fun Fact: Past Exorcism, Marissa Paternoster has painted some crazy shit on the walls. At their request of course.)

I recently saw Brian play drums in his band Risk Relay and he is really fucking good. It's drumming that is weird but not like, "Oooh look how weird I am!" weird. (You know what I mean.) Technical, but not showy. Fancy, but not for the sake of it. In other words, like...really fucking good.

Anyway here you go. Here you are. Here we all go.

AN HISTORICAL SELFIE.

-What made you wanna play drums and do you play any other instruments? 

It's kind of difficult for me to pinpoint exactly when because I started to become interested when I was 8 years old (I'm almost 35 now.)  I do remember being really into watching MTV, and at the time ridiculous hair metal and Guns n' Roses was pretty much dominating air play.  I remember sitting on the couch, watching music videos and trying to play along with chopsticks.  I also had an older metal head cousin that played, and when we would visit I would watch him shred on one of those enormous two bass drum, eight tom,  two hi-hat, seven cymbal monstrosities….and of course I thought that was the coolest! 

I can play a very small amount of guitar and bass, but I've always been a bit clumsy on both.  I feel like it's one of those situations where being ambidextrous works to my disadvantage; I'm left hand dominant, but I play guitar right handed…I feel like there's always a certain degree of disconnect between what I'm thinking my fingers should be doing and what they're actually doing.   

-What bands got you into music? What about them was inspiring? 

I remember really wearing out my Appetite for Destruction cassette…and then moving on to Iron Maiden, Metallica, Slayer, Anthrax, Megadeth, Overkill, and Nuclear Assault.  I think I was mostly drawn to the over the top nature of what they were doing, whether it was trying to be more technical, badass, fast, or mean-sounding than anything else that was out there…although I'd still argue that Gn'R and Maiden wrote some legitimately good rock music.

-What drummers were your faves growing up? What about their style was interesting to you? 

This is pretty embarrassing considering the guy is now one of the most gigantic turds in music, but I used to think Lars Ulrich was the most creative drummer.  I thought his work on ….And Justice for All was brilliant at the time, but then again, I was still just a kid.  He would play all of these weird timed fills and arrange parts such that each time through the same section of a song he would play something that sounded similar to what he played the previous time, but just a little different.  I always thought Glenn Evans (Nuclear Assault) was really good.  I think I just liked how fast he would play…and he would always have a few songs on each record where he would rip some absurd drum solo at the end of the track.  For the most part, I've never been much of a fan of individual players.  It just so happens that most of the bands I like have competent players.

-Do you feel like your fave drummers changed as you got older? When listening to your old faves now, do you hear their playing differently as opposed to hearing them as a kid?

Sure.  When I listen to Lars now, I feel like I'm listening to a deaf Ringo Starr playing heavy metal.  It's just incredibly goofy sounding to me.  I wonder whether it was all the result of him always being a poor player and lots of tape being spliced together to make it sound passable.  In general, I think my tastes have changed a lot.  I used to think the more notes you could play, and the faster you could play them, the better.  I still love a good shred fest, but I can also appreciate simple, more subdued playing.

-How did you learn to play? Self taught or did you have lessons? How (besides being more comfortable probably) has your playing evolved?

I took lessons for a good six years or so.  I actually played on a practice pad for a couple years before I got my first drum set.  I used to be able to sight read pretty well too.  My instructor never knew I was left handed, so he taught me to play as a right handed player.  I think this worked to my advantage in the end because I was constantly working my right hand harder than my left.  Eventually he saw me playing as I do now (left hand leads, right foot leads) and was like, "Why didn't you tell me you were left handed, you schmekel?!"  I didn't know, I was only 10 or 11 years old…I thought there was only one way to play! 

My playing style has always been tied to the kinds of bands I've been in, and I've really not played with that many different people.  I was playing mostly in Bad Religion sounding punk bands in high school, which doesn't really allow for that much creativity.  I would just try to play as fast and hit the drums as hard as I possibly could.  As the different incarnations of Risk Relay took form shortly after high school (yes, we've been playing together that long) I started to mess around with more syncopated stuff, more counter rhythmic stuff.  I've managed to stop hitting the drums like I'm mad at them…try to listen and balance the kit and just play less, play slower.  I've also developed a dislike for open hi-hats and cymbals in general.  I think that comes from having such a hard time dealing with them in the studio on occasion.

-How do you feel about playing live? Talk about whether or not you have now, or ever had, any kind of stage fright. 

I've been playing shows for almost 20 years now and I have only started to enjoy them in the last five years or so.  In the past I feel like I was way too serious and far too concerned with perfection.  It got to the point where people would complement me after a show and I'd be so furious about some dumb mistake or dropped stick that I'd actually tell them they were wrong and that I fucking sucked!  I still get annoyed when I make a mistake but I feel like can hear the whole picture now…so if the band sounds good to me for 98% of the set, I'm happy.

I'm always a little bit nervous, but I've never had any kind of stage fright.  At the same time I've not played many "big" or "important" shows.

-What got you into recording bands and who taught you how?

I was always interested in sound.  When I was maybe 12 years old or so, I discovered that you could "multi-track" with two boom boxes.  Record something on one, and then play it back while playing something else and recording on the other boom box.  Very sophisticated analog setup!  Then I bought a 4-track in high school and messed around with that quite a bit.  After quite a few poor experiences making records with a bunch of different recording engineers (some quite famous and expensive) I became convinced I could do the job better and not be a dick.  So I took some classes at Brookdale Community College and interned at a studio called Technical Ecstasy with my current studio partner, Chris Pierce.  I took what I learned by watching there, bought some of my own stuff and then starting asking my friends to let me record them for free.  The best way to learn recording is by doing it.   

-How has your knowledge of being able to record sounds affected your process of making a record for one of your own bands? 

I think it allows me to map things out in my head a bit more as far as the process goes.  Like I'll have an idea of how I want to try recording certain parts…whether that's in a wacky way or very straight forward.  I also think my band mates are more willing to follow my lead when I make suggestions or have an idea in the studio because they trust that I've been through the process enough times.  But most importantly, it makes every record we do take forever!  It certainly helps me to have someone else help out.  I had Chris Pierce take care of almost all of the setup during basic tracking of the most recent Risk Relay record, "After Fake End Times."  It sounds great but I'm still searching for the right amount of control to take for one of my projects.

-What are some memorable recording processes with bands in the area? Feel free to be really specific and really scathing. 

I prefer to be pretty vague in terms of the bad stuff.  I know it's boring, but I don't really need to rehash the specifics of those sessions. I've seen a lot in a relatively short time.  I've seen bands disintegrate in front of me; members get kicked out…spoken to in ways that were indescribably evil.  It's always a challenge to make sense of the wreckage after a bomb goes off…it's like, "So…are we still making a record or….?"

Some stuff has been pretty random…I recorded a few songs for the band Mother Night and the bassist decided he was going to smoke some pot before he did his backing vocals.  I figured he was an experienced stoner, but really he hadn't smoked in years.  He legit fainted in the middle of his take…fell backwards…I was still recording in my parents' basement at this point so I guess I'm lucky he didn't hurt himself!  I once shared an interesting conversation with the members Psyched to Die about the Woodsporn phenomenon…the ancient tradition of using the woods of NJ as a secret library for porno magazines. 

Really, the most memorable recordings were the ones where the band could play and the people involved were all good.  "The Secret Audio Suspense" EP I did with The Unidentified, Screaming Females "What if Someone is Watching Their TV?", The Ergs "That's it, Bye" all come to mind.  They were so enjoyable because nothing happened.  The bands showed up to make a good record, and that's what we worked towards.  There was no drama, no bullshit, no awkward moments…I even managed to make a few good friends out of the deal.

  

PERSONAL

-Where did you grow up? What are/were your parents like? Do you have any siblings?

I grew up in South Brunswick NJ.  My parents are both retired/nearing retirement.  Oddly, my father doesn't listen to music at all.  Literally does not own a single recorded album.  Neither of them are what you would consider particularly creative, so I'm not quite sure where I came from.  Most importantly, they have been incredibly supportive of me.  From letting my bands practice in their home, to letting me record there, to helping me to get through college at ages 28-34.

I have a lovely older sister, Michele, whom I often kid about her name being spelled "like a boy's name."  She lives in Cambridge, Massachusetts with her husband, 2 year old son, and month and a half year old twin (!) daughters. 

-What was school like for you?

Academically, school was always a bit of a bore to me.  I was never much of a reader and always thought that no one needed math because calculators were invented.  So in high school I didn't really give much effort, but I got good grades.  I played in some bands but somehow playing in a "punk rock" band in high school doesn't really make you a ton of friends.  I did one semester at Rowan…I hated living in a dorm and I really couldn't figure out why I ended up there other than that's where my parents wanted me to be.  So then I did the recording/communications program at Brookdale and still really didn't give much effort to any of the courses besides the audio related ones.  Fast forward a bunch of years….I just graduated Rutgers May 2013 with an Electrical Engineering degree.  I really enjoyed the engineering program.  If you're ever really ready for it, school doesn't have to be that difficult. 

-At the risk of sounding cheesy, how significant a role has music played in your life? 

Without music, I'd probably be heavier (drumming is great exercise), have more stress, fewer friends, less to be proud of in my life, and fewer interesting things to do.  I might have a little more money, though.

-Ever see any ghosts or weird paranormal shit?

Ha.  Not exactly, but I get this weird kind of déjà vu where the event seems familiar because I feel like I once experienced it in a dream.  In fact, it just happened to me today while I was in this future looking presentation room at work!

 



Thanks BUX! Here are links to Volume IV and Risk Relay

Exorcism Number Eleven: SELF-EXORCISM!

 Here is an essay that I have been working on regarding gender equality. My amazing editor friend Janine Kamouh and my amazing husband Jeff both helped me make some more sense. Many thanks to those two lovely people and to all of you for reading. I encourage comments and an ensuing dialogue! 

 ON BEING A LADY...

AND DOING A THING

What the heck do we all want from life? Most of us just want to be treated with respect. And I think most of us would agree that there is a huge difference between ordinary "kindness" and actual respect. Kindness has this patronizing air that I find difficult to swallow.  When people respect you, they'll give you constructive criticism. They'll tell you when you have made a mistake. (Or many mistakes.) I love when people tell me that I could do something better, because it means that they think I am CAPABLE of being better. I hate being infantilized. Condescension is spectacularly awful and is trumped only by one thing: invisibility. I'd rather be loathed than be invisible.

Why am I writing about this? Well, all of this comes to mind because in my 19 years of playing an instrument, I have felt a lot of feelings about how I am perceived by people of both sexes and all orientations.  I have wondered whether or not I am respected as a human being and worthy of being taken seriously. I have almost always been treated with kindness, but I have been forced to consider whether or not the music I produced was being respected.

And all of this first world pondering brings me to THIS: When on the rare occasion that I have been interviewed, inevitably the question of "What's it like being a lady AND a musician??" will rear its hilarious head. And when it does...I pause. I recognize that it is a huge honor that anyone would ask me anything ever, and then I usually say that it's no longer a rarity, and that I have been lucky enough to have encountered little to no sexism. Most definitely, I could give a more long-winded answer about what it's like to be a lady and do a thing ALL AT THE SAME TIME, but I don't. I FIRMLY believe that if you say it is rare, it is going to STAY RARE. If you act as though it is commonplace, it becomes commonplace, and with any luck the chances of being asked that question again diminishes. Like maybe, I could be asked about something having to do with the music that I make instead. To reiterate... it's nice that I'm being asked anything at all. However, "What's it like being a lady and doing a thing?"  makes me feel as though you do not respect me as a musician.

Weirdly, one of the only times I have encountered real-life sexism is when an interviewer asks me how I deal with all the sexism that I am (supposedly) constantly encountering. Wrap your mind round THAT, music "journalists."  Stop asking how I cope with being the rarest of rarities! It breeds the idea that female musicians are RARE when we are absolutely NOT. It creates a conflict where there is literally no reason for a conflict to exist. And PS: I have been asked this question by women as often as I have by men.  None of us need to mention we are a "female" anything anymore. If you point out your gender, your gender becomes the focus, and the gap widens.

Now, this makes it SEEM like I think sexism is a figment of the imaginations of delusional women who are blue with the monthlies. Believe me, I am aware that sexism exists and it produces horrors that only a real lack of civil equity is capable of producing. Really unfortunately, some people have been taught to think that women are lesser beings and that we don't do things. And if we do choose to do something it is going to be of a lesser caliber. You guys: Let's not let this get us down!! Men and women alike, let us move past these dark times and actually become respectful of each other! WE CAN DO THIS!

Let's remember what respect really is: it's thinking of all humans as being equal.  It is my dream that such equality can produce a blissful kind of transparency in relation to gender. As in: one should not censor one's self with the opposite sex because, except for the parts we have, we are essentially the SAME.  Now, I admit that this is difficult especially because most of us were raised to think that women and men are practically different species. But the way we think and act is adjustable. Questioning your thoughts and your actions is a powerful thing. Occasionally scary, but always powerful.

Question whether you actually believe women are to be taken seriously in any and all areas of life. And please consider this kind of thing really deeply before you go hog-wild and call yourself a Feminist. Feminism is not about having crushes on girls and thinking they are adorable when they play in bands. It's more complex than that with multiple facets, all of which are highly debatable. Don't be afraid when you realize that it is more difficult than you originally thought. Respecting the depth and complexity of Feminism is something that I grapple with every day. For real.

Think about whether you include women in conversation or if you only make occasional eye contact with them. Think about whether or not you have EVER made eye contact with women! I know that a lot of men find women to be intimidating. However I think that there is a huge difference between being intimidated by a woman and thinking she is a strange and untouchable deity. Again, we are all the same. Just different parts. (We are the same. Different parts. We are the same. Different parts...It's a handy mantra!) Yes, our bodies are more beautiful than yours. Thank you for noticing. But we still like, fart and stuff. And drum. And sometimes both of those at the same time.

All in all, I know that most people are really well-meaning and that our mindsets regarding women and all forms of equality usually boil down to our different experiences growing up. I have been lucky. I have had amazing parents and really strong female role models. I was never made to feel like I couldn't do something. And I am so so grateful for that.  I recognize that we all have not had that experience. I just think that we might as well all make the best of our time here. Even when it is a confusing fucking mess of hormones, we can still find the time to use our heads and be respectful.

Thanks for reading!

Exorcism Number Ten: Joe Keller

Hey everyone. Thanks for checking in. Today we have the awesome Joe Keller formerly of the Ergs and currently the bassist for Night Birds. He is a stand up dude and an INCREDIBLE musician. I was really excited to read this and I hope you are too.Thanks again for reading <3

         
 What was the first band you were in and what got you into music?

The first band I was in was called The Flatliners and it was with your dear husband, Jeff Schroeck.  I replaced the first bass player, Kyle.  I don't know what exactly got me into music, I guess it was an escape and a way to learn about taboo things in an age before the internet.

You have an incredibly strong work ethic when it comes to music but you don't make it seem like work when you play! Talk about this and about whether or not this has always been the case.

Thank you!  When I started playing music, all of the other guys I was playing with were already good – Jeff Schroeck,  Mike Yannich, Jeff's cousins, a couple other guys.  They were legit good in high school – not just good for kids, actually proficient.  So when I decided to play bass, I knew I had to get decent quickly if I was going to be able to hang.  That meant I had to do all of these drills and scales to get good enough to play with them.  I think it was just a habit that stuck.

 You are also an engineer. How do you balance these two (fairly) different aspects of your life. Do they facilitate each other?

They don't go together at all!  Somehow, over the years I have through mostly just dumb luck fallen into a situation where I can work as an engineer and do a band on a slightly-greater-than-just-a-hobby level.  Once I realized that the odds of being able to live off of being in a band were even slimmer than they had been in previous decades, I had to strike some sort of balance between the two instead of just pursuing one. 

When did you meet Mike and Jeff and how have your relationships changed over the years?

Oh man, this could be a whole book right here.  I’ll do the abridged version:  I met Mike first in freshman year of high school.  Mike, myself, and a bunch of other alterna-teens and nascent punks all sat at the same lunch table.  Mike's band, Visual Purple, was playing one of those god-awful Saturday matinees at Club Bene (later Club Krome, later an abandoned building) and I attended.  My first memorable interaction with Jeff was watching him play a set with Mike.  He had a dyed blonde skunk stripe in the middle of his hair and he was wearing hospital pants – he was tall even back then and was, despite his appearance, somehow very mature so I thought he was a senior in high school, but he was actually two grades below me.  Right after he hit the last note of the last song, he threw his guitar square into Mike's drums.  Mike then toppled over his remaining cymbals.  All of this was pretty standard operating procedure for high school bands at the time, but this was mere weeks after some poor kid had taken a cymbal to the head at Club Bene and subsequently died.  So, of course I thought Visual Purple was the coolest thing in the world even though they bummed the local skinheads out so much that they just sat on the edge of the stage for pretty much all of their set.

The Ergs years were obviously the tightest we all were – we all went through a lot in that band.  It was a very strong bond.  Unfortunately, when the band broke up, I took out a lot of my frustration on Jeff – I didn’t talk to him for about a year.  I had a lot of misplaced anger.  Thankfully, we have patched things up since then – even now, Jeff is the more mature one.  I still keep in touch with both of them although we don’t hang out at nearly the same level as we used to because that would mean we’d be  in extremely close quarters in a van 50% of our waking hours.  When we’re in the same room now, it only takes about 60 seconds before we lapse into the same gibberish in-joke we used to say all the time, though.

 Talk about the evolution of pre-Ergs to full-on Ergs and about your first experiences playing together.

The Flatliners morphed into a band that was Jeff, Mike, myself, and a drummer, Helen Destroy (who went on to drum for The Lunachicks and Lez Zeppelin).  Mike was on lead vocals and guitar.  Helen lived kind of far away so she couldn’t come to practice super often.  When she wasn’t around, the rest of us would fool around with songs in the Ergs configuration only with Jeff doing most of the lead vocals.  We were supposed to do a “reunion” show one night in Jersey City on New Year’s Eve 2001 and Helen couldn’t make it so we did 75% Off instead.  The night after, it was either Jeff or Mike, can’t remember who, who decided we should just do that as our main band.  We changed the name to The Ergs and went from there.

How has Night Birds changed over the course of a few years and do you have specific goals for what you want to accomplish?

It definitely feels like Night Birds 2.0 now with PJ and Ryan in the band instead of Mike and Coastman.  I like both eras though.  PJ and Mike are both such different guitar players with their own distinct style.  I don't think Night Birds would have ever been good at all if we didn't have Mike starting off – you know just as well as I do what that crazy weirdo brings to the table.  He was the first musician that really made me think about tone – from guitar tone to overall sound of a record.  PJ gave the band a whole new slant and I think it comes off in the recordings we did with him.

I didn't really have any expectations when Night Birds started – I guess I wanted to do something very different from The Ergs to see if I could.  The one goal I had as a musician was to tour Europe (well, that's a lie I also wanted to play on the Conan O'Brien show, but that dream is dead since he doesn't have the same show anymore) and I got to do that with Night Birds.  So everything now is pretty much gravy.

What was it like embarking on a new band after being in a very successful band? Did you feel like you had to start all over? Were you worried about people's expectations for your new project?

I hated it.  I freaked out the first 9 months or so after The Ergs ended.  It's silly to think this now but I thought I was done in terms of ever being in a band – like I was not fit or able to be in a band again.  I had some serious bass player inferiority complex going on.  I had been doing the Ergs for so long and so hard that stopping it just broke my brain.  A former member of Duke Ellington's band once famously said that after he stopped playing with Ellington, it felt like he “slept for a year.”  I definitely felt like that – I was drained from working a full time job and then playing shows on weeknights where I'd get back home at 2-3AM only to get up again at 6AM to go to work the next day, kinda like Steve Martin's character in “All of Me.” So I slept for a year, but after that it was sort of a blank slate situation and then I was kind of cleared of any worry over expectations.

But despite all of that, there are a lot of fun feelings being in a brand new band that I had completely forgotten since the beginning of The Ergs (my general rule after 2003 or so is one band at a time.)  For instance, when you start out, if you don't write a song every week, you will have nothing to do at that next practice.  So there's that urgency to write something – or playing a first show.  All that stuff was new again to me.

Looking back, it was definitely a good thing for all three of us, though.  I always like to draw parallels between personal romantic relationships and being in a band.  Since we started the Ergs when Jeff was still in high school, the band was like marrying your high school sweetheart right after the prom and never dating anyone else, if that makes any sense. You need to have a couple of relationships and make mistakes before you have a good long lasting one with someone.  Since we never broke up, none of us learned things about being in a band that one really only reflects on and considers after the band is done (I am speaking for Jeff and Mike here so I don't know if they agree.)  But myself personally, I know that as soon as I was in another band I realized how TERRIBLE of a show booker I was.  We were playing all of these awful shows at the very end of the band's career when we were supposedly this (relatively) big deal.

PERSONAL....

Where did you grow up and what is your family like? Have they always been supportive of your musical goals?

I grew up mostly in Old Bridge, NJ.  My parents were both public school teachers.  They have always been ok with my musical goals – although they really have no interest in the music itself, which is fine.  There was an era of The Ergs where we would practice at my folks' place.   I think they sort of looked at music as the thing that would keep me out of real trouble – I’m sure they were worried I would do drugs but they were pretty sure I wouldn’t steal anyone’s car if I was in the garage playing Kraftwerk covers.

What was your school experience like? What role if any did those experiences play in becoming a musician?

I know it's such a stereotypical thing to say, but I was a total nerd and was treated accordingly.  I think everyone should have a shitty time in high school though – I think the people who are on top of the social ladder in high school usually wind up the most screwed up later in life (although a lot of the time, those very same people on top were not having a great time either.)  You need the misery and humiliation of high school to prepare you for the real world.  So of course that sort of environment is what led me to hang out with similar weirdos such as Mike Yannich and listen to freak music like punk rock.

Any paranormal experiences?

I once slept in a cabin that formerly served as a hospital for Nazi soldiers in WWII but thankfully I was not accosted by SS ghosts.

HA. Thanks Joe. Check out Night Birds because they are one of the best bands. 

www.facebook.com/NGHTBRDS